By Nina Lafleur
It is perceived by some that there is a speeding problem within Marsh Creek. Some who are new to Marsh Creek may not be aware that this issue has been raised and addressed by our Board almost every other year.
Previous Boards have addressed the issue as follows: informing the homeowners of the speeding issue and requesting compliance; reviewing and adding additional speed signs; engaging the St. Johns County Sheriff’s office to review the situation; installing and monitoring of speed cameras from the Sheriff’s office; placement of large portable blinking speedometers; and the research and pricing of speed humps installed on the roads.
Regarding the issuance of speeding tickets, the consensus at the time from the Sheriff’s office was that there were not enough cars going at least 5 miles over the stated speed limit to make it feasible to have them in the neighborhood to issue speeding tickets.
Recently, the Safety and Security Committee organized a well-attended meeting of homeowners to once again discuss the various options to address this perceived problem. One opinion suggested that no speeding tickets are issued within our community because the speed limit signs and stop signs are not FDOT compliant. Another opinion suggested that additional stop signs could provide a “traffic calming” effect and a chart of proposed new stop sign locations had been prepared.
At the August 30, 2022 meeting of the Board of Directors, the traffic calming theory was raised and the Board discussed and voted to approve the installation of stop signs at the triangle intersection of Marshside Drive and Marsh Point Circle. It was agreed by the Board that following installation of those stop signs, the matter would be reviewed and discussed before any further efforts were put forth regarding this matter.
At the September 27, 2022 meeting of the Board of Directors, the issue of traffic calming was raised again. This time the discussion involved the engagement of a certified engineer to advise the Board and the HOA as to the necessary requirements for bringing our signs into FDOT compliance. (It was noted that the state-required specifications for traffic signs can readily be obtained directly from FDOT).
While noting that the Board had not yet approved moving forward on this issue, the Safety and Security Chair obtained approval to move forward and obtain a proposed plan from a certified engineer. The traffic calming issue was also raised by the Finance Chair, who estimated the proposed plan and implementation will cost homeowners approximately $50,000.00 and that it will be paid out of reserves.
Homeowners were advised to attend the next Safety and Security Committee meeting on the 3rd Tuesday of the month to have their voice heard before additional, costly decisions are made. That meeting will be held on October 18, 2022 at 10:00AM.
As stated in this informative perspective article, “It is perceived by some that there is a speeding problem within Marsh Creek”. It is safe to say that some pedestrians and cyclist perceive there is a speeding problem. The Board is entertaining this perception by investigating ways to calm motorists. A previous post about this issue in the Courier stated that there have been no reported motor vehicle collisions within Marsh Creek, never. Therefore, we should recognize that motorist’s behavior may not be the primary issue to address. From the perspective of motorists, the behavior of the pedestrians on our roads is a real problem. Folks walking carelessly in the middle of the road, often with loose-leashed dogs darting about, are a true traffic and safety concern. Add to that the bicyclists/tricyclists who ignore their responsibilities to abide by traffic laws. Perhaps the Board should first view changing pedestrian behavior as a prudent and cost-effective solution.
I completely agree with the previous comments. (To include 24 hour security staffed on the back gate). The perceived speeding issue is exactly what was stated in a previous comment. It looks a lot faster when you are walking along the road and someone goes past you at 25 mph. Now unless you have a radar gun or maybe have some law enforcement training you probably cannot accurately judge the speed of a moving vehicle. Case in point, I recently saw a post from another Marsh Creek resident that called out a my neighbor for speeding on Herons Nest around a corner and she estimated the person was going 40-45 mph. I researched this area myself (after making sure it was safe) and went around this corner around 30mph and found that it was a difficult speed to maneuver around this curve in the roadway. There is NO WAY my neighbor was doing the speed perceived by this resident. The proposed measures such as speed humps, more stop signs, and speed signs that flash how fast you are going make the community look clunky and bring our home values down. I would also be willing to bet all these zealots that are pushing for these measures have gone over the speed limit or rolled through a stop sign or two while traveling through our neighborhood. Let’s be realistic, those that are going to speed through the community are going to continue even with the measures suggested.
As for the closure of the back gate in the evenings, I am willing to pay a little more to ensure our community stays safe. It was noted in another post that a “Knox box” will be installed to allow Fire/EMS through. As a retired firefighter I am very familiar with the Knox box system. While it does allow access to areas that may be locked or secured there is still a delay in accessing the point of entry. When a unit comes to the gate and has to access the Knox box that unit will have to stop, someone will have to get out, locate the box, access the key, then open the access point with that key. Hopefully they will leave the gate open for other responding units if necessary. Also in my jurisdiction the fire and police had different Knox boxes. I am not sure if this has been addresses to see if police and fire have the same key.
Overall we need to pump our brakes (pun intended) and really look at this realistically and if the means justify the cause. I am not aware of any person being struck in our community by a vehicle. I know it only takes one time and god forbid if it does happen and someone gets seriously injured or worse killed. We also need to take proper measures of safety when we are walking or biking through the neighborhood. I see so many people walking on the wrong side of the street, people with headphones in and are oblivious to their surroundings, and bikers/walkers in the middle of the roadways.
I want a safe community just like everyone else. I love where we live and I enjoy walks and biking throughout our lovely neighborhood. Let’s keep it that way and not booger up the looks with these measures proposed.
What is the monthly increase in HOA fee’s that the residents and golf coarse are willing to pay to have the police patrol marsh creek? $100 a month ? How much of the HOA money from savings will be used up on this project as hurricanes become stronger every year. Will the police be able to stay in the parking lot at the club house as they have done before.
What is the cost to widen the road to make it complient with county road requirements? The new sign was placed 2 feet from the road , the others are 3 feet and more , if it is hit and damages a car or truck is the HOA responsible for the damage done.
The last time we paid for police to come into marsh Creek they sat at the clubhouse and watched everybody come in and out of the clubhouse. If we have to pay the police to patrol marsh Creek on a regular basis it will cost us a fortune and we will have to pay that in our HOA fees on a regular monthly basis our fees will for sure go up. Anybody who does not want to pay huge fees to have the police patrol our neighborhood should show up or voice their opinion to the board that this is not what they would like to have done here. Or just go ahead and add $100 a month to your new HOA fees. I will bet the special assessment fee for making our roads county compliant in Marshcreek will make everyone’s head spin around three times.
Thanks Nina! I think stop signs placed at strategic intersections on major street are a logical solution.
And let’s not take money out of the reserve for an engineer if state-required specifications for traffic signs can readily be obtained directly from FDOT. Reserves are for emergencies. It’s a needless expenditure when the community doesn’t have enough money to pay for repaving our roads.
I drive through Marsh Creek every day, and see no evidence of a speeding problem. Drivers give plenty of space to walkers and cyclists. We should calm down, and depend on our members to drive carefully, especially when passing walkers and cyclists.
This discussion has helped because by now everyone is aware of the issue, and cautioned to drive safely.
By the way, I support retaining full 24 hour staffing of both gates. Marsh Creek is a first-class community, and we should not be cutting back on our security.
Thank you Nina for encouraging our community to respond to the “stop sign gone wild” problem we have with the Safety and Security committee. The vast majority of speeding problems are indeed the perception of speeding as opposed to reality. When you are standing still with your dog or walking against traffic, 25 MPH appears fast. Studies the Board commissioned a few years ago showed that less than 8% of the autos were doing more than 5 MPH over the speed limit. The real issue is the false belief that stop signs slow people down or make an intersection safer. Study after study show that not to be the case and is why communities are removing 4 ways stop signs. The environmental impact (noise as well as toxic emissions) obviously dramatically increase when our autos and more importantly, our service provider trucks get back up to speed. A cross walk to the park at Wandering Lake Blvd and Wandering Lane would be more than sufficient on our straightest road in the community, with no driveways or mailboxes, an unobstructed intersection, and the only road we have with a sidewalk! A yield sign at most at Marshside Drive and Marsh Point Circle would be more than adequate. Stop signs are not the answer.